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Author Topic: QMA Crap  (Read 7630 times)
Swartz
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« Reply #30 on: October 10, 2011, 07:09:39 PM »

For the record, I don't have a "side" in this. The existance of QM clubs predates both the sanctioning bodies and there are a lot of clubs that are members of neither. Choosing to have sanctioned races, of which there are only 3 in QMA, is a decison a club can make but is not a prerequisite to exist. A lot of us wanted to be able to host both sanctioning bodies at our tracks which would have expanded the opportunities for everyone but QMA would have none of it. They wanted it their way or no way. So, here we are.
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Indy360
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« Reply #31 on: October 10, 2011, 07:23:22 PM »

Scott, I agreeI that QMA needs to figure out why clubs are leaving. It is absolutely true that the board members are to act in the best interest of the club. But doesn't our board members have to follow certain guidelines? Our government does. Though I would totally disagree in the board just taking a vote without any input from the members they could have off collected data, notified all members (which didn't happen in this case) in the proper amount of time before the meeting, listened to whatever members had to say and then vote.

This is not what happened. The board called members in favor of USAC, sent out emails in favor of USAC, held a meeting and did a sales pitch in favor of USAC and then voted. Afterwards they held a meeting and didn't notify any of the members. If they would of just given the pros and cons of each they wouldn't have been in the predicament they found themselves in.

You are wrong about me not being ok with a private vote. Why would I not be. Only one member per family gets a ballot and then you vote. Have Jason and Paul do a count in front of the members and then we're done. Board takes the official vote and then we go racing.
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Indy360
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« Reply #32 on: October 10, 2011, 07:33:13 PM »

Swartz, That would be neat to hold both USAC and QMA races at the same track. For Mini-Indy that would be great. For QMA  to not allow this is wrong in my book. I personally do not care what it ultimately  ends up as long as the majority of the members want it and the minority feels it was done properly. I think this is easily accomplished. Some obviously do not.
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sfreitas20
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« Reply #33 on: October 10, 2011, 07:45:56 PM »

"This is not what happened. The board called members in favor of USAC, sent out emails in favor of USAC, held a meeting and did a sales pitch in favor of USAC and then voted."

To use your words and play devil's advocate here, do you know these to be fact?  Did you sit through all the phone calls and witness all the emails sent to know they only sent them to members in favor of USAC?
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Scott Freitas
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sfreitas20
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« Reply #34 on: October 10, 2011, 07:59:08 PM »

For QMA to not allow this is wrong in my book.

Funny, I just re-read this and a comment made earlier about how actions detrimental to QMA are reason for banishment from QMA.  Makes me wonder why the National Board members in QMA that refused to allow dual charters when USAC first started were not banned for "Actions detrimental to QMA"? Smiley

Indy360, I do sympathize with what you are going through.  Our club was taken from us without a member or even a board vote.  The owners of the property that our track is on, decided the track was going USAC and just showed up at a club board meeting to inform the board that the club was being folded and they were now running it as a business and not as a non-profit club.  At that point we all pretty much just decided to show up for the next race and as it turns out, our kids could care less whether it was QMA or USAC, they still raced their guts out just the same and played with their friends just the same.
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Scott Freitas
Patriot Motorsports Inc.
divit
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« Reply #35 on: October 10, 2011, 08:55:45 PM »

I really appreciate you comments 360.  I agree that the best option would have been for a fair vote.  You may not agree or believe the members who were around 3 years ago (I don't know if you were or not), but they will tell you that the vote that was held 3 years ago ruined friendships, led to significant animosity, and led to several families leaving Mini-Indy.  The BOD tried to avoid that situation this time...obviously the same issues will occur here, BUT the only people officially on record are the BOD.  Other members have the luxury of not having to answer to those who feel they can manipulate members to vote their way.  A silent vote would be great, but again, this has become way too emotional and personal. 

I would like to address the your comment on the CoC pertaining to the paperwork that was signed.  I would agree that the Board violated that "rule".  However, it is a bogus rule.  It is put there for QMA to protect themselves, a club could never change a sanctioning body if board members (or even regular members) couldn't speak to the club about their ideas for bettering the club. I would suggest if you have not had the opportunity to talk to BOD members and regular member who supported QMA sanctioning last time and now support USAC sanctioning.

I would also challenge your comment that the data was not presented fairly or in a timely manner.  The committee that did the study was not made up all members who were pre-disposed to be USAC supporters.  All the data they accumulated was given to the members.  That data was presented as objectively as possible...yes the data favored USAC, but that was the data.  If approached objectively, it was pretty compelling.  QMA supporters tried to say that the data was incorrect...there may have been small errors in math or assumptions, but from a high level, it would be difficult to change the story...A couple other examples...in the backup data, when QMA was asked what they would to to help promote the club, their answer was that they tell people they have been doing this for 50 years and  they have coloring books.  USAC discussed using their promotion department, having the kids at the 500 festival parade, and having our track be the test track for anything they need to test.  Let's see 500 parade or Coloring Books?!?!?!?  Also, when asked what QMA was doing to lower costs, they said that they book their own travel to Vegas.  Last time I checked I can book my own trips and it doesn't save me any money...How about reviewing the need for the Vegas boondoggle?  USAC brought in a spec tire to keep costs down and is looking at stamping tires at all National events to keep racing costs down.  Theses are just a couple examples of the data the committee brought to the BOD and the members. 

In my discussions with QMA supporters I was clear that I was ok that we could disagree, but when they went after the BOD's kids, I believe they crossed a line.  No BOD member ever said or proposed "hey let's not let the QMA supporter's kids race".

But...QMA has Coloring Books to help save Mini-Indy
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shanker
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« Reply #36 on: October 10, 2011, 10:40:16 PM »

OMG !!! Really, is this what everyone does is bash this person and that person and this organization,that organization.. People let's get real here and think about what's most important .. The kids that are racing !! Personally if your unhappy with the change then go do something else. Trust me I'm fairly new into quartermidget racing itself, but this sounds like bunch of politics griping back and forth. Go to DC if that's what you like to do they sure would love to have some more help.( maybe that's why car count is down ) our government.  Let's ask our selves a question why are so many clubs going to USAC!! I have seen 2 clubs in last month go to USAC from QMA, and there has been nothing said or wrote about them... So why mini-Indy?? I don't race this club never have but when USAC takes over I will be there for sure. Let's get real and be concerned about a place for kids to race.. Way to go James and the USAC staff for working hard to bring racing back to Indy...
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Indy360
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« Reply #37 on: October 11, 2011, 05:13:22 PM »

"This is not what happened. The board called members in favor of USAC, sent out emails in favor of USAC, held a meeting and did a sales pitch in favor of USAC and then voted."

I wasn't trying to say that only pro-USAC members were called by the board member,  I was trying to say the board member that called the members was in favor of USAC. After re-reading that I understand I wrote it incorrectly. All you need to do is call Paul who did the calling and ask him to verify this. Emails were sent from board members and voiced there wanting to switch to USAC. these are readily available if you do some research. And the meeting is on video so I'm confident that what I've stated are facts.

Divot, The way this has been handled has caused more damage than 3 years ago. "It has ruined friendships, led to significant animosity, and led to several families leaving Mini-Indy". But worst of all we aren't racing and this whole thing might go to court. either way this ends up some members aren't going to come back. How then can we argue that this was done the right way?

Regarding the rule that you admit wasn't followed because it is a bogus rule. Your reasoning was that "It is put there for QMA to protect themselves, a club could never change a sanctioning body if board members (or even regular members) couldn't speak to the club about their ideas for bettering the club." I must ask. Have members of every club that has switched or tried to switch to USAC been kicked out of QMA? Just saw were LSQMA switched to USAC. Did memebrs get kicked out of QMA from that club? I really don't know the answer to that. I would argue that if it was done by the book nobody would have gotten kicked out. Maybe the board should have called clubs that have switched (an not gotten the boot) and asked them how it was done.

You say that small errors and assumptions may have been made in presenting data to the members. Why? All the information is readily available from past history at the track and from USAC events. To say that some data may be wrong makes me wonder what that is. Did you inform the members of these mistakes?

In an earlier post I stated that I didn't want anyones kids kicked out of the club and therefore some kids not being able to race. That would be horrible! I don't believe that any members of Mini-Indy made that choice. You admittingly didn't follow the rules and therefore some members (not me!) felt the only way to get you to slow down and talk was to file a COC. You had the choice to race, all you had to do was let the members vote and no one would lose their QMA membership. Even if the vote went USAC.

Shanker, I have the same frustration as you. This was done just like D.C. That's my complaint! You make another good point about what is important "the kids". Some of the members want to race at Mini-Indy. That's the only place they want to race for reasons like time, money and the track itself. If this was done differently they would be racing whatever way it turned out. If it was done in a fair way and switched to USAC then so be it. If QMA members didn't want to race after that then that's on them. The majority of the BOD are traveling members. Mini-Indy is just another track they race at. For the BOD, in my opinion, this hasn't affected them. They children were still racing this weekend weren't they? In my opinion the reaason you hear about Mini-Indy and not the two other clubs that have switched is simple. The way it was handled!

I see the reasons that the BOD wanted to switch to USAC. You don't have to sell me on it. That's not my point. It's not anyones point that I know of. It is the way it was handled. The members felt that they didn't have a voice, that no one would listen to them. Sure they got to stand up at the meeting and talk but as stated in an earlier email that unless the membership expressed "resounding opposition to a USAC" they were going to vote for USAC. to me that means that they were willing to vote for USAC even if the majority of the members didn't want it. Maybe not if 90% of the membership wanted QMA but what about 60%? How about 70%? Seriously what does that mean?

Most members don't care what sanctioning body that Mini-Indy ends up with (me included). But "does the ends justify the means"? To me the answer is no.
 







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shanker
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« Reply #38 on: October 11, 2011, 05:58:32 PM »

Let's start another blog for people to complain at,(iwannacomplain.com) to me this is just turning current or future families that wanna race and get into quartermidget racing away from the sport. Again its not about the parents its "ALL ABOUT THE BOYS & GIRLS" that wanna compete in a racing enviroment. So lets get over it and move on..
360 looks like to me your fighting an uphill battle, sorry for that. If true racers will remember when Cart & IRL split how good was that for the racing industry. NOT TO GOOD. Truly this is what happening in quartermidget racing as well,(QMA vs USAC) so if parents dont get rid of there egos and just go have fun with their kids its gonna get worse before it gets better.. Hope everyone that is reading all these comments made on this site will sit back and really think whats best for their family and go do it and enjoy it.  Shocked
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RBurns17
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« Reply #39 on: October 11, 2011, 07:52:33 PM »

In an earlier post I stated that I didn't want anyones kids kicked out of the club and therefore some kids not being able to race. That would be horrible! I don't believe that any members of Mini-Indy made that choice. You admittingly didn't follow the rules and therefore some members (not me!) felt the only way to get you to slow down and talk was to file a COC. You had the choice to race, all you had to do was let the members vote and no one would lose their QMA membership. Even if the vote went USAC.

There is nothing in a bylaws that say they have to let the members vote.....

I can tell you, no matter what anyone says, they didn't let the members vote to avoid the corruption of the 08 vote. Anyone who denies that there was corruption is fooling themselves. Now, you're seeming angry at the politicking on behalf of some of the board members, but the president is doing the same thing on the other side. Emails have been posted of a couple of officers on the other side planning to sway members to the QMA side. That's just part of it. If I were you I would be more worried about the fact that former members and other club presidents are calling the shots for Mini-Indy.

There were at least 20 Mini-Indy families at Kokomo this weekend and I don't think a single one of them was pro-QMA. But, I guarantee if you were to pencil in a vote for next week QMA would still get a majority. There weren't that many in 08 that wanted to stay QMA either, but the small but vocal minority, backdoor deals, and threats kept the club QMA. That's just a fact.
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slowpoke
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« Reply #40 on: October 11, 2011, 08:48:25 PM »

Why do such a small handful of people in region 4 keep trying to hold onto QMA ? This area is almost completely USAC clubs and doing very well I might add. The racing is some of the best I have ever seen every week at any of the tracks here and everyone seems to be enjoying themselves. I sure am glad our club is USAC so we dont have to deal with the ignorance that we read about here in this thread. Most of the USAC clubs here have a higher car count for the weekly races than the remaining region 4 QMA clubs have for their regionals. So why wouldn't the remaining QMA clubs want to race with more cars at the USAC tracks? It only makes sense to be a USAC club here in region 4.  Mini Indy will thrive once again with USAC , I know lots of people that want to go there and race but we are not QMA members and probably wont be any time soon.   
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outlawqmracer
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« Reply #41 on: October 11, 2011, 09:11:45 PM »

QMA’s 50th Anniversary ~ 11-18-2011
Re-conciliation or Re-declaration of Independence
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes;

But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security…

To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

1) THE GOAL of QMA for the past 50 years has been “to build and strengthen the association through unification by conformance to rules and regulations under one jurisdiction.”  I claim the
current and past QMA NBOD did not uphold our By-Laws but basically made up the rules as they went, interpreting them to be used for the betterment of their own political points of view!
   
2) QMA’s Mission Statement was changed in March of 2009 from it’s original noble purpose which was to strive for a clean, safe, healthy sport which may be enjoyed by ALL in a close relationship with GOOD SPORTSMANSHIP” to “QMA realizes there are other racing organizations out there but”….  Their political points of view have overruled their concern for their members rights they were supposed to protect and out of fear and anger created a beaurocratical nightmare much to the detriment of QMA and it’s membership.

3) The QMA “Code Of Conduct” Statement was re-written from something intended to protect members from physical and sexual abuse, to be used as a weapon against QMA members and their right to free speech by terminating memberships of anyone they claim is “acting in a way detrimental to QMA”. Said suspensions were not in accordance with codes.

4) Election Fraud- A) Nominations for QMA office have been disallowed due to recently imposed deadlines. They didn't even bother to change the bylaws. No one really knows what the stipulations for running for office and such are and if they want to find a reason to allow or disallow something they just come up with one of their Famous “Clarifications”

B) The Election Procedure Guidelines were changed just one and a half months shy of last years’ election.  It  stated, ONLY  members who PAID their 2010 Dues by October 31, 2009 will be allowed to vote for National and Regional positions. Our Charter clearly states that this procedure is illegal and doing so drastically changed the way QMA has done business for the last 50 years. According to California Corporate Code and our QMA By-Laws membership is in good standing through December 31st and members should have been allowed to vote in the past couple of elections as well as this year!  The numbers of members voting in past elections needs to be addressed because there have been so many people defrauded of their voting rights that the current system is incapable of a fair election.  




C)- The changing of the form of balloting from paper to online – without clear & proper notification to membership.
  
National BOD – Meeting minutes from Nov. Unless the National office hears from you or a member, it will assume that you will be voting online. Members must be validated. Only Art, the webmaster will have access to the voting area. All ballots, paper and electronic, will be sent to the accountant for counting. Will further disenfranchise many voters.

 This procedure was implemented in November with the election just a couple months away. How are voters being made aware of this change out of the racing season? The net result is again that it will cause many more votes to be lost.

D)- The new rules have been orchestrated to restrict who may run for office and to limit the number of voters, so as to affect the outcome of the election. This too is specifically prohibited in our corporate charter.  In the last Quarter Reporter it stated that QMA had a total membership of 2,694.  My question is simply how many of those people received a ballot and voted last year?

5) Sunshine law violations- The NBOD does not properly publish meeting minutes so that the membership is aware of discussions regarding important QMA business, but rather discusses issues amongst only themselves.  They fail to place MANY of the items brought forth by
 members’ onto meeting agendas including but not limited to RCP’s.  These items are summarily dismissed by the National Board, especially if they are not in agreement with the QMA membership further separating themselves from a proper discussion process.

6) Discrimination- NBOD has Suspended and/or restricting memberships and terminating membership without due process. Our corporate charter SECTION 5340-5342 stipulates proper notice be given in all suspensions and the member then has a right to file an appeal. This process has never been proper within QMA. The National board cannot just let in anyone they like and forget about those members’ rights that they don’t personally agree with.

7) Financial Hardship-The cost of recent engine tech updates ie: keyway, flywheel, tech tools, and head replacement, differences in engine platforms and rules from other sanctioning bodies is detrimental to QMA’s original goal to have unified rules across the nation. This is driving members away from QMA and to USAC and Independent Clubs that have not imposed those added costs to their membership.

Cool Misappropriation of Funds- Giving far too brief financial statements to the membership, where the members cannot tell what is going on. For instance, Quarter Reporters can not be mailed but time and money is wasted publishing and sending the revised QMA Mission Statement as well as retractions and clarifications to the members giving the NBOD political stance on the happenings of the quartermidget world, at the cost of thousands of dollars, and then in a stroke of genius “to save money” NOT send everyone election ballots.

9) Actions Detrimental to QMA- By restricting membership and terminating members without due process, Hijacking our club by throwing out nominations and RCP’s the BOD does not agree with, Causing members financial hardship with new tech and membership decisions that benefit the NBOD, both politically and financially they have harmed QMA.

10) Making Misleading or False Statements- The QMA NBOD have continuously made false statements both to attain office as well as hold onto it. Examples are in evidence.


QMA Requirements for lawsuit /election process reconciliation:
                   
1)   That all members be allowed to vote in this years election regardless if their memberships are  
renewed by the recently imposed deadline of October 31 or not, and that all members in good standing through Dec. 31 be allowed to vote in elections as per CA Corporate Code.

(2) That a list of those suspended or denied membership for whatever reason be published.
  
(3) That those suspended or non-renewed members have their rights of notification and of a hearing upheld and according to CA Corp. Code if due-cause not proven be reinstated.

(4) Involve past & current membership – make sure past members who may have been driven away from QMA for whatever reason and would like to re- join QMA have that opportunity, and to ensure their voting rights.

(5) That the National Mission Statement revert back to what it was on November 18th 1960 when QMA was incorporated and the version drafted in March 2009 be completely annulled!

(6) That ALL RCP’s submitted to the National Board by Regions go to vote at the National meeting.

(7) Have a mass outreach effort to anyone involved in quarter midget racing as well as those planning on racing next year and invite them to become members.

(Cool That un-approved membership applications and nominations along with their postmarked envelopes be held on file with documentation and to simplify the procedure used in the process.

(9) Have balloting at QMA club meetings as they do in many Region 2 clubs, make said meetings mandatory, and have regional & national officers as well as an independent accountants oversee the process. This would attain the goal of cost control that QMA is trying to achieve and at the same time make sure all members get to cast their vote. The recently imposed online election process is good but there is simply not enough notification given to primarily rely on that system at this time.

(10) That an overseer of the election be appointed for both the nomination and election processes.
Have a fair, honest, open election where 100 percent of members vote and ALL votes count!

(11) That the Quarter Reporter be published monthly and for the content to actually keep the members informed of what the National Boards decisions are. A lot of the trouble within our organization is that the membership is not being communicated with effectively.

(12) That changes to the way QMA does business require amending the By-Laws the same way that changes to anything in the rulebook occur, by vote at the National Meeting or if online elections are held by referendum of the members. That way any major changes will be made public in the beginning of the year and be published in The Short Sheet from said meeting that every member gets yearly with their Rulebook.

(13) To adhere strictly to the QMA Bylaws and Rulebook. Any policies made under the current and former administrations that are not published in either of those documents, should either have a motion to be accepted by membership and included in them or disallowed and completely voided.

(14) To uphold the findings of a recent QMA poll that showed 87 percent of the membership wanted an “open door policy” at its events, where any quarter midget participants could race.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2011, 09:15:30 PM by outlawqmracer » Logged
Melmo
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« Reply #42 on: October 12, 2011, 09:42:45 AM »

So mini Indy won't be racing this weekend?
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Melmo In The Fast Lane!!!
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