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October 02, 2014, 02:29:33 AM *
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Author Topic: Honda Engines  (Read 8545 times)
Seipy
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« on: October 02, 2008, 08:03:35 PM »

How would we like to have the rules handled for the Honda Engines
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Seipy
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« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2008, 08:09:49 PM »

I think some of the rules for the Honda engines are just plain stupid! It is pretty bad when you can get a new motor out of a box that will not meet tech. Also who cares what color the engine shroud is painted! Pretty bad to DQ a child because she likes pink for example. They had a choice recently with this whole flywheel bit. Either have the thousands of the motors out there retard the engine timing they have OR advance the timing of the new ones coming out. Hell, They should have just said 25 degrees max (Arbitrary number) and covered all the bases and everyone would have been legal.
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Seipy
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« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2008, 08:12:43 PM »

The new Burris F200 series is running 200CC engines from Yamaha, Briggs, Honda, Kohler, and Tecumseh. They have a very nice set of engine rules that actually covers all engines. The first level of teardown is "Non - invasive". How many of you are tired of going home with your engine in a box?? There has got to be an easier way.
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goffin20
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« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2008, 10:10:35 PM »

As previously mentioned, "unfortunately Honda doesn't just build there engines for us to race"

This is Exactly why we should go with Briggs who makes engines specifically for racing like the Animal and World Formula which are also affordable.

http://www.briggsracing.com/racing_engines/

Makes more sense than running an engine that is built primarily for pressure washers, air compressors, welders, edgers, tillers, and other various equipment. By the time we get the Tier II motors phased out and converted to the new Tier III's, they will probably have a Tier IV in the works for bio fuel to meet California's strick emissions.

Jr.Nov - Animal Restricted - A
Sr.Nov - Animal Restricted - B
Jr.120 - Animal Restricted - B
Sr.120 - Animal Restricted - C
Hv.120 - Animal Restricted - D
Lt.160 - Animal Restricted - E
Hv.160 - Animal Unrestricted
Lt. WF - World Formula Restricted - F
Hvy WF - World Formula Unrestricted
Half - WF No Rev Limiter?
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goffin20
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« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2008, 10:15:39 PM »

Never did understand why we do not allow the same valve springs in both the 120 & 160 since the springs being used for the 160 last twice as long.  Doesn’t seem like much but add up springs every couple races for 3-6 cars.  Just another small way to save members money...
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mothersworry27
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« Reply #5 on: October 03, 2008, 10:11:50 AM »

Quarter midgets ran B&S motors far a long time.  The Honda was introduced because B&S motors were escalating in price because of a no mod rule making motors that dyno or flowed better like gold (3000-5000) for a block.  Sound famillar?  It really is quite simple, when you show up to race you take your motor to tech they seal it tag it with a number and put it on a shelf.  You go to sign in and pull a number for a motor, go to tech and pick up your motor.  Nobody is going to go and buy a 1000 dollar motor and nobody is going to bring junk.  everybody is going to bring a 400 dollar motor.  New motors would have to brought (back) to older levels so to keep cost down for existing motors.  When manufacturers change to a point where you can't exchange older part numbers then is the time for talk of change.  As for changing to B&S, why? more speed? less cheating? Hondas are definately cheaper out of the box then world formula and animal.  The B&S motors were built primarily for air compressors etc. and B&S also change to comply with EPA ( I think this year they had a new head and exhuast ? )  Keep world formula a class keep honda 120 and 160 a class and use this lottery system or some similar to keep the cars equally powered the setup and the driver will shine through.

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deerbybow
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« Reply #6 on: October 03, 2008, 10:14:31 AM »

guys why are you still complaining? the rules are not hear yet for usac? I hearthat Honda is looking into a race engine, but as far as I ahve seen and been apart of most of all the current track records, with the old motor and timing, have been broken!! yes broken in sr honda and alot of heavys.  I have seen kids that were 15-30 pounds over do it!!  so really, how much of it is motor?  while i agree it can be doe better/cheaper, give it a rest.  adapt to it, deal with it and move on.  rules are rules, aren't we all smarter than just paper?  adapt and overcome!!  practice, experience and driver usually make the difference!!  not the motor, unless you have a real dog, but should't you be able to tell you have one??  CAN"T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG!! LOL
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Justin
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« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2008, 12:29:04 PM »

my thought: Honda Has a better built tougher, longer-lasting engine. where i work we sell both Briggs and Honda as well as others. but by far the Honda engines are the favorite. my boss (who knows his stuff, he used to race and quit for his nephew to race, now his nephew has 2 sprint titles and his name is Levi Jones) just started the honda business about a year and a half ago. they seem great! i love them myself and you can NOT break them!
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To race is to win. To get 1st is to succeed! To succeed to to make dreams come true!
goffin20
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« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2008, 01:24:25 PM »

I myself have always been a Honda man, mini bikes, dirt bikes, street bikes, mowers etc.  They are bullet proof and will run forever, no doubt there.

However, my complaint is that they do not have a racing platform for us to use, instead, we are using motors that they manufacture for yard and farm equipment.  If they had a racing platform I would be all for it, but they don’t.  That means that decisions Honda makes on the platforms we run are not in the best interest of the racers since we would be the minority.

B&S has a platform built specifically for racing which makes a lot more sense, it has nothing to do with speed.

As for cost, after paying a builder to prep a Honda, the box stock price just doubled in price from 400 to 800, some even more.  The Animal and WF would be a lot better option even with us having to add a gearbox to them for close to the same price.

Decisions made for QM racing should always be about
1.   The kids & members
2.   The longevity of the sport
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dgriffin
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« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2008, 01:29:14 PM »

I like the hondas I think they are more dependable and much easier to start and work on the last thing usac would ever do if they want alot of members would be to change engine platforms from qma maybe look at some adjustments after it gets built up a little but no way would they try it now.
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dgriffin
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« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2008, 01:32:40 PM »

remember most members will come from qma hopefully some will be startup  but most will defect from qma.
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goffin20
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« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2008, 01:41:57 PM »

We are one family that will definately run QMA & USAC so the Honda will help in that respect. 

However, I would sell my Honda to a QMA member (if there are any left) to buy additional briggs motors for USAC should they choose to phase them out.

A real racing sport deserves a real racing platform...
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crew chief
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« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2009, 12:47:56 PM »

Is usac going with honda or briggs
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Barr
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« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2009, 12:59:31 PM »

Honda
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goffin20
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« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2009, 01:30:32 PM »

I believe they are running the same classes as QMA, Honda, Briggs and Deco to start with.  I can’t see Honda being the surviving platform in the long run, Briggs would be the wiser choice because they have a racing platform for a racing sport.
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